[0:00] take out your Bibles one more time to the epistle of John the first.
[0:14] That was kind of a new way of saying it. First John. First John chapters one through five. This is our last look at John.
[0:27] Not last ever, but last in this series. And we want to recap the whole thing today.
[0:40] And that will mainly be up to you. Because this is your turn. This is a time where we can discuss and apply and talk about what we have learned over these last 20 weeks.
[0:58] Not a year, just 20 weeks. In this wonderful book of John. In your bulletin, you will find a whole chart.
[1:15] A whole book. All five chapters summarized in a nutshell for the price of nothing. For the low price of reading, I guess.
[1:27] So just to kind of give us a point from which to spring from. We're not going to go over all of it. It's just kind of giving you kind of what the summary is. The nutshell of it.
[1:38] What I want to do to start is to read chapter 1, 1 through 2, 6. Just to give a kind of remind us of how John began this letter.
[1:51] And then we'll look forward to time together in it. So if you're able, please stand as I read from 1 John 1, 1 through 2, 6.
[2:02] 1 through 3, 6. 1 through 3, 6. 1 through 3, 6. 1 through 3, 6. 1 through 3, 6. 1 through 3, 6. 1 through 5, 6.
[2:13] 1 through 6. 1 through 6. 1 through 6. 1 through 6. 1 through 6. 1 through 6. Life was made manifest, and we have seen it, and testify to it, and proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and was made manifest to us.
[2:40] That which we have seen and heard, we proclaim also to you, so that you too may have fellowship with us. And indeed, our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son, Jesus Christ.
[2:57] And we are writing these things so that our joy may be complete. This is the message we heard from Him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in Him is no darkness at all.
[3:14] If we say we have fellowship with Him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. But if we walk in the light, as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another.
[3:32] And the blood of Jesus, His Son, cleanses us from all sin. If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
[3:43] If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us.
[4:01] My little children, I am writing these things to you, so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ, the righteous.
[4:14] He is the propitiation for our sins. And not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. And by this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
[4:32] Whoever says, I know Him, but does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in Him. But whoever keeps His Word, in Him truly the love of God is perfected.
[4:48] By this we may know that we are in Him. Whoever says He abides in Him, ought to walk in the same way in which He walked.
[5:00] So it reads, let us pray. Father, guide us today, as we seek to apply and think through the big picture of what John has presented to us.
[5:12] There is much here, but Father, lead us, direct us, that we might benefit, that we might have fruitful discussion. That we might connect some more dots.
[5:24] That we might see a little bit more clearly. Not only what John is saying, but how we live and how we can recognize true life in ourselves.
[5:37] This we pray in Christ's name. Amen. Please be seated. Anybody have a cup of coffee this morning?
[5:51] Cup of tea? What did you put in it? Nothing? Cream? Sugar? No? Honey? Oh, honey's not here, sorry.
[6:03] So, I want you to imagine you have that cup of coffee. Let's say it's coffee. You're holding a cup of coffee when someone comes along and bumps into you.
[6:17] Grabs your arm where you're holding the coffee and making you spill your coffee everywhere. Let me ask a question. Why did you spill the coffee?
[6:31] What do you think? Why did you spill the coffee? Somebody bumped in? No, that's not the right answer. Why did you spill the coffee? Lost a grip? No, that's not the answer.
[6:41] Why did you spill the coffee? Because you were drinking it. Drinking what? The coffee. Yeah. I think it's because of gravity. You spilled the coffee.
[6:53] No, no, no, no, this is more practical than that. You spilled the coffee because there was coffee in your cup. You spilled the coffee because there was coffee in the cup. If you had tea in the cup, then it would be tea that you spilled.
[7:10] See, it's very simple. Whatever is inside the cup is what will spill out. Oh, life lesson. Oh, here we go.
[7:20] Watch it. Watch, connect this thought. Watch. When life comes along and the bumps in the road and shake you up, and that will happen, whatever is in your cup will come out.
[7:39] So we have to ask ourselves, what is in our cup? When the trials come?
[7:51] When the storms come? What comes out of your cup? Is it joy? Is it joy?
[8:04] Gratefulness? Happiness? What comes out of your cup? Anger, bitterness, harsh words, reaction. What is it?
[8:14] See, this is what John, 1 John, is all about. What's in your cup? What do you have? What do you have? How do you know you have eternal life in your cup?
[8:26] Now, this is not a judge my cup by every single spill.
[8:37] Right? I will have days where I get bumped and not my best stuff comes out. Right? So we're not looking at it one incident kind of thing.
[8:50] What's the pattern? How do you do overall? At the end of the day, something just flew out of my mouth. I hope that didn't capture on the video.
[9:02] You guys spitting stuff all over this. So John sets up several contrasts in this book. We've seen that all along. He says, light and dark.
[9:15] You either walk in the light or you walk in the darkness. You are either walking in the truth or walking in a lie. You either love your brother or you hate your brother.
[9:31] No in between. You either are abiding in life or abiding in death. You either confess Jesus or you deny Jesus.
[9:45] You either believe God or you make him a liar. You either listen to the spirit of God or you listen to the spirit of Antichrist. For John, there are just two ways.
[10:02] So, that's what John presents us. Now, I want you to look at your chart. You've got a chart on the back of your chart. You don't have to look at your chart. Just color it if you want.
[10:14] I don't care. You have the chart on one side, which is a synopsis of John. On the back, you have a lot of detail. That's not what we're going to look at today.
[10:24] On the back is the outline of everything that we went through. So, if you want more detail, you can look at that later. Okay? We're not going to review everything we went through. So, look at the chart.
[10:36] That's what I want us to focus on today. All right. I want you to notice, this is a recap of 1 John, which I'm calling authentic Christianity because John's really saying, if you say something, that doesn't mean you are the real thing.
[10:52] If you say, but you do something else, then you're a liar. Right? If you say you're walking in light or say you have fellowship with God, but you walk in darkness, you're just a liar. That's not true.
[11:02] That's not authentic. Authentic people walk in the light, even with their sin. Right? That's how we get our sin cleansed. Right?
[11:13] So, authentic Christianity. I wrote under the title there, the purpose of the whole book, which he gives in chapter 513.
[11:24] I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God. Why? That you may know you have eternal life. So, he's going to give us the identifiers, the gauges, the tests of eternal life.
[11:37] So, notice they're grouped into three boxes. Okay? Group them on the left side, test one, our walk with God.
[11:47] The center box, test two, our love for one another. And then test three, our faith. So, those are the three general areas John is going to look at. He's going to go through them over and over and over again.
[11:59] It's going to cycle through them. So, notice on the left, you start with walking in light or darkness. Go to the middle column. Then it's loving our brother or hating our brother.
[12:10] That comes right after. Notice the walking is, first column is from chapter 1, 5 through 2, 6, what we just read. That's walking. And then the very next verses come to the next column, loving our brother, hating our brother.
[12:24] Very next verses in 2, 18, in the third column to the right, are confessing or denying. So, he's going one, two, three through the tests. Then he's going to come back and go through the three tests again.
[12:35] Practicing righteousness or laying down our life or believing Jesus' name. So, he goes through the three tests three times in a row. Then, once he gets to chapter 4, he's going to talk about testing the spirits.
[12:50] Then he's going to come back to love again. Talk about love for all. Then he's going to come back to chapter 5 and talk about faith. Okay, so that's kind of where it's going. Don't have to follow all that.
[13:01] I'm just kind of pointing out how it's laid out. The main thing I want you to see is the grouping of box 1, walking in light. Box 2, loving our brother.
[13:13] Box 3, faith and belief and confession. Okay, those are the three main areas. Okay, so that's how it is. You have a lot of other information on the sheet because I had time this week and I got kind of nuts.
[13:28] Oh, look at this phrase. I got to put all those down. All the key words and whatever. So that's just there for your information if you want it. If you don't, then draw over it. I don't care what you do.
[13:40] Okay, so let me start in general. I want to ask you, what have you learned? How has this book of John impacted you?
[13:53] Has it challenged you? If it's challenged you, in what way has it challenged you? What has God shown you through this? Or clarified for you?
[14:05] Whatever. Just general. Before we get into the specifics. Just what has God shown you? What have you learned? How have you been impacted? Has it changed anything in you?
[14:17] Changed any view? So kind of just general questions. Just big picture. Who? There's really no middle ground.
[14:29] Okay. John's kind of hard-headed, huh? Yeah. One or the other. Two kinds of people in this world. Right? Is it love, kneel, die?
[14:41] No. I won't go there. Right? Children of God or children of the devil. You're either from God or you're from the evil one. So that's it. Not everybody will like those classifications, but that's, John's just going to be straight up.
[15:03] Simple. What else? Yeah. He's not a lot of middle ground. Yeah. Marianne. He's challenged me to love. Love. Loving.
[15:14] Again, there isn't a middle ground. There isn't a loophole. Love if, right? Love no matter because he has loved us.
[15:25] That's a challenge to me. Yeah. Because there are people I question. I don't know if I can. Yeah. How can I ever forgive that person?
[15:37] Yes. Right? And yet God has forgiven me. Yeah. Yeah, it's very, very hard. Right?
[15:49] That's what it's done for me is pointed out forgiveness. Yeah. Not just forgiveness of others, but forgiveness of myself. Why?
[16:01] You said there's no middle ground. Yeah. If he does, why don't you? Yeah. Is John anti-sin?
[16:14] That's kind of loaded, isn't it? Yes and no. But he's not looking for perfection. He's not. He makes that clear in the first chapter, right?
[16:26] If you say you're not sinning, then you're a liar. He's not saying that. What would you do to reconcile it? What you do to reconcile it? How do you do that?
[16:39] Reconcile. Confess it. Confess it. Walk in the light. So what we naturally do is what we just read Adam and Eve did.
[16:51] When they sinned, what did they do? They hid. They got it covered up. God makes them walk out into his light. And then he fixes them.
[17:04] What are you wearing leaves for? Let me get you some nice leather. Yeah. Yeah. It's the woman. What's the woman say?
[17:16] It's the serpent. Not my fault. Yeah. Yeah. We do that too. God just takes them one at a time. Of course, no answer for the serpent.
[17:30] You're losing your legs, boy. All right. What else? I wrote down a statement that said, this is just what hit me a couple weeks ago.
[17:40] True prayer releases us to be exactly where God wants us to be. I like it.
[17:57] Practicing. Practicing? What about practicing? You like that word? Practicing righteousness or practicing sin?
[18:10] Which do you practice? So why do you like that word? What's? Because it's not perfection. Right.
[18:22] It's being perfected. It's a process. Process. And it implies intentionality. So if we practice sin, we don't have to be intentional about that.
[18:34] It's just natural. Right? That's just who we are. We do that. We don't think about it. That's how I'll react in that. When I get bumped, that's how I'll react if I don't think first.
[18:48] Right? If I'm not already thinking. But practicing righteousness, there's a deliberateness to that. I start my day. I start with prayer.
[18:58] I start with focusing, renewing my mind, that kind of thing. Right? Not like Peter caught in the... Right? Well, you know, the army's out there.
[19:10] I'm ready to fight. But then he's in the... Peter's stuck in the campfire, right? And he's guards down and safe and a little tap and...
[19:21] I'm ready for that. Yeah. Little girls are scary. Let's not say that out of context.
[19:35] I get it. What else? What else? What have you discovered? What has been challenging? What's changed? Or what's clarified?
[19:46] Well, for me, like Mary Ann talked about the loving piece. When you defined the word hate, you talked about ignoring or thinking little of.
[20:04] And that really convicted me because I thought that if I'm not engaging in a hurtful, ugly way, then that's loving in a sense.
[20:21] You know? Right. If I'm just neutral, right? I'm avoiding the opportunity or the chance that I might get ugly, which is, you know, there's a situation in my life where that's the way I've been.
[20:35] If I'm just you're queer, then I won't be tempted to... Yeah. So that's been very convicting to me. Yeah. Yeah, the whole... All the love sections are pretty convicting.
[20:47] They're like, wow. Especially when we're comparing our love to God's love, right? So what if God loved us... What if God ignored us?
[20:59] Right? That's hating. If he withheld his love, which is withholding life, then he's killing us. Then he's a murderer. And that's what John is saying.
[21:11] When we're not actively loving, if we're withholding that love, we're actually a murderer. Because we're withholding life. Even if it's just a gift that helps them that day.
[21:26] That's still what John calls a life. Laying down my life. Giving my life. A piece of me. And if I withhold that, I'm... Yeah, that's really convicting.
[21:38] That's really tough. What if he loves us the way we sometimes love others? Don't even think about it. That's a harsh reality. Yeah. And that's exactly right.
[21:50] Yeah. I love these people, but not that person. Yeah.
[22:01] Yeah. I'm more conscious of my walk now. Good. Yeah. You know, the things that are, I'm doing, and so, if I were really thinking about this in the way of the Lord, I probably wouldn't have done it.
[22:18] But instead, now, I'm actually trying to do this. I'm going to be working for this. Right. Right. But it's just stopping to think, you know, how would he, he has loved me like this.
[22:32] Right. I know what I am about to do is wrong, so I'm not going to do it. Okay. It's, it's again, working hard. Oh, yeah. Very hard. Yeah. Oh, it's, it's a process, right?
[22:45] So, I love your form. Oh, I'm glad you like it. Yeah. It's, it is. It's really lovely, because we do that pre-tush.
[22:57] Yeah. But, one of the things that's recurring to me, that I see recurrent, is, we tend to be deceived. And, so, in light of Paradise Lost Day, and, and, even, eat, we, are very, vulnerable, to deception.
[23:23] Yeah. So, what John, First John does, for me, is, reminds me, take these tests, or these measures.
[23:35] Take the tests, or the measures. Where am I at, in that? Where is, in the testing of the spirits, where is the other person, as well?
[23:47] Should I be listening, to this person, or not? And, so, I think it's a wonderful letter, in that sense, that he, he accomplishes, two feats, here.
[24:02] Yeah, when you kind of, look at the whole thing, and kind of, group what he's done, it's, wow. It's really a masterpiece.
[24:14] It's an amazing letter. It's, because you can read it on one level, and just be very simple, right? Like his gospel, we can read his gospel, just be very simple. I don't have to be, real deep to understand it.
[24:26] But then, if I want to go deeper, there's depth there, if I want it. So... And we're always subject, to deception. Yeah. Because there are seasons, when we, as you were saying, and others have been saying here, there are seasons, when you're very, yeah, we can deceive ourselves, or we can be deceived, by false teachers, or we can be deceived, by the evil one.
[24:53] Exactly. Right. And he mentions all of them. Yes, he does. Can't we sometimes deceive ourselves? Yeah. Yes. He says, if you say you have no sin, you're deceiving yourself. Exactly.
[25:04] Yeah. He mentions that. Mark. One of the hardest things, that I ran into, is the holding yourself, you know, isolating yourself, from other people, where you take and say, okay, and does that hate?
[25:20] Okay. Now, let's try to overcome that. Take someone, I called, you know, I have not called in years, and said, talk with them.
[25:31] And yet, still, I find myself, holding a little bit, in the loop. Rather than going fully with it, sit there, talk to them, listen to them, be polite, be nice, but still aloofness.
[25:46] That's hard. That's very hard, to get through that, and be able to express, Adelina, I love you.
[25:56] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Trying to bring that out, and put it to the point. It's so easy, to hold that little piece of yourself, and put yourself back, and try to go out, and do that.
[26:12] That's, that makes it hard. Yes. John 1, is hard work. Yes. Yes. Well, the standard is, as he walked, right?
[26:24] Yes. And we can't do that, but we strive toward that. Is there a difference between forgiving, and reconciling?
[26:41] Yes. Yes. I forgive somebody, who's hurt me badly, does not mean I trust them. Does not mean we're good.
[26:53] Because that takes two sides. Remember? So, forgiving, letting it go for my sake. Really? So the devil doesn't have an opportunity. Right?
[27:03] So I'm not holding that grudge, and I'm not, I'm only hurting myself, right? By holding that. But there's a difference. So, if I want reconciliation, that's another step.
[27:14] And that means they have to be willing to do that, too. Are we allowed, though, to try to reconcile? If they don't want to, fine.
[27:27] But isn't that kind of what Bart was saying, that if we're not being around a person? Yeah. If, yeah, I have some people that have hurt me badly, but they're not in my life at this point.
[27:41] I'm not going to seek that. I don't feel any need to do that. So then I'm a little confused. I have to forgive them. Right. But if I'm not working with them, I don't think I need to reconcile.
[27:55] Maybe I do. Maybe God needs to convict me of that. I'm just telling you where I'm at at this point. And maybe that's part of me that says, I don't want to deal with those people anymore. That's the heart. Right.
[28:05] So, so if God tells me, and now I got to go in Psalm 139, I got to search me and find, you know, show me. And if, don't, don't make, put me in a box where I got to go do that now.
[28:18] So, bless you. I know. I know. Innocent, innocent question. But do you love them? Because if you don't love them, then you hate them.
[28:30] See, that's where I'm going. Oh my. It's just not for you. It is a bit confusing. Right. We talk there. Yeah. We're saying it. Really saying.
[28:40] Mark, you want to take over? Mark, you're not in the hot seat. Got to think about that. Got to think about it.
[28:50] All I was saying, to try to weasel out of this, all I was saying, was because you forgive, doesn't mean the relationship's healed.
[29:01] But are you, do you have a response? Do you want to do something about healing that relationship? And that's why. You do to a point.
[29:14] So, thinking about this. So, Paul says, you, you, you rebuke a divisive person twice.
[29:24] And then you have nothing to do with them. Nothing to do. And there's the scripture that says, if someone has something against you, leave your gift and go.
[29:38] Yes. So, how does that apply? That, um, so, so, go ahead, Rick. Yeah. Save me.
[29:51] I believe the Bible teaches that reconciliation begins with you. It is not the connection that you have with the other person. It's how you view the other person in your heart.
[30:02] What kind of chain are you swimming, swimming with? Because someone hurt you. The forgiveness piece occurs within you first.
[30:13] And then as you have opportunities, translated to the opportunity to reconnect with the other person. But recognizing we only have the ability to do that, that we have within ourselves.
[30:26] The other person may not be receptive to that. Exactly. And could it be with boundaries, maybe? But, but we still have to be willing to let go of the problem. Right. Which goes back to what Mark was saying, because sometimes, man, I don't want to let go of that.
[30:40] It feels good to hang on to that. It feels, I've got some addictive thing that I get to do, because I get to hang on to that, whether they even know it or not. Does that help?
[30:52] And there's that scripture that says, as much as it depends on you, live in peace with others. Right. That's right. Which is an indicator that we each have a responsibility for our part.
[31:03] Right. And we can't force it. So if the other person's not interested in the reconciliation, you know. Well, and the verse that you brought up just a moment ago, too, if you feel that someone has something against you, you leave your gift on the altar, and you try to go resolve the situation.
[31:24] So, they may not have anything wrong with you, but it's still within you that you think there's a problem. It's your responsibility to fix that problem to the extent that you can.
[31:36] I don't understand. I think it's back to Mark's comment about being hard. It's not your responsibility to come and say. Oh, it may be. It is. It is their responsibility. If they're a believer, it is their responsibility.
[31:47] But they may not be able to do that. Or they're, you know, they have the same problem we do. And I think when you love a person, you don't bear hate in your heart, which is part of the forgiveness process.
[32:01] If you truly forgive someone, and there's that love process that goes on, I believe that the next steps all happen very naturally from within you, because you are following God and Christ, and allowing the Holy Spirit to guide you.
[32:24] And it may not look as beautiful and perfect as we all like it, and reconciliation between two people may not occur, but you're not resisting it.
[32:37] And the opportunity may not come up, to do it. But you've done what you've been commanded to do. Yeah, and if we follow Jesus' instructions to pray our prayer every day, right, we deal with that relational issue every time.
[32:59] Forgive us as we have forgiven. So every time I pray that, faces come to my mind. And I have to re-look at, okay, and now because Susan brought that out, now I'm going to go have to talk more about that.
[33:15] So I'm on your need to forgive. I'm going to have to forgive Susan now, so yeah, because I really got a grudge. I'll reconcile. But if we're genuinely praying through that, right, and I get to that fifth one, forgive us as we forgive, I may have to go to Psalm 139 and say, okay, if you keep bringing this face to my mind, show me.
[33:42] Search me, show me. And he's, that's a scary one, because he'll always show me something. He will show me something. That's kind of according to his will, right?
[33:54] It's one that he will always fulfill that request. Exactly. Oh yeah, I've been waiting to tell you about this one. That's when you become responsible. Right, oh yeah. And suppress that.
[34:05] Right, but if you're willing to do, not my will, but thine be done, right? That shows love in your heart too, and that shows the reconciliation. So, it's hard, but we're not alone to do that.
[34:20] Amen. He will guide us. If I need counsel, I'm going to pick out a couple of brothers, or one, and then say, pray with me over this.
[34:31] How do I do this? What have you done, right? What convicted me, and what's convicted me several times about, when I need to forgive somebody else, it can be one-sided, but what it does is releases me, from the feeling of needing to retaliate, or hurt that person, for hurting me to begin with.
[34:52] Yeah, I'm giving that up. And it's because of where the source, of where that's supposed to be coming from. And the other thing that struck me, because John talks about laying down our life, and making a propitiation, right?
[35:06] So we're to love like God, and God loves us by sending His Son to be the propitiation for our sin. So He deals with our sin. So when I'm forgiving somebody, I'm dealing with their sin.
[35:19] I too, like God, must make a propitiation, which means, I'm going to cover it. You hurt me, I'm going to pay the price.
[35:31] I'm not going to require it from you. I'm going to bear that. I'm going to bear it. I'm going to take that scar, and live with it. That's how I'm thinking, right?
[35:45] To be like God. To bear the scars like Jesus did. No, wait. Whoever. All right, go ahead. I'm a little confused on this.
[36:00] What I'm hearing, according to the Word, we have a change of heart towards that person, which is total forgiveness, forgiveness, and we need to love them the way the Lord has loved us.
[36:22] Do you have to let that person know that you've actually changed how you used to feel about them, that the past is the past?
[36:34] It is. I'm not looking for a loophole. If it's going to shock them, yeah, then I don't say no. And again, look to the Lord, get some counsel.
[36:45] Here's our relationship. What would you do? Do you think I need to... I think that's where you get some other folks. Wouldn't that be shown in your actions, though? I was about to comment that. Yeah, you'll want to.
[36:56] Maybe they would know this. Yeah, you're going to be... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think we all heard the story about Corrie Ten Boom here recently, right? Where she was speaking publicly about her faith, and then she met a person who came up to her later that she recognized as a guard in the concentration camp that she was in.
[37:20] But I didn't get the impression that he recognized that she was one of the people in the concentration camp. So he came up to her simply with, hey, I'm a new believer.
[37:32] there was no request or reconciliation from him to her because he didn't even recognize that she was in the concentration camp. And she didn't bring...
[37:43] He was in his hand to her. That she absolutely, positively recognized him. And she didn't bring it up. And she didn't bring it up. No. She didn't bring it up. Wow. And...
[37:53] And she resisted. And the Holy Spirit somehow got her arm up so that she could shake hands... Wow. with this individual. So that would be...
[38:04] Talk about tough. I think something that we've all experienced here recently. Is it necessary? If there's an obvious thing between the two of you, yeah.
[38:17] I don't think they need to do that unless they ask you to forgive them. I think it's the actions that you... To tell them. If they came up and the guard recognized or said, I'm so sorry, will you forgive me?
[38:29] Yes. That's one thing. But I think if you're saying, hey, I forgive you and it was unsolicited from him, he's looking at you like... For what? You know, as a human, as a sinner, he's going to say, what, you're better than me?
[38:41] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And this goes back to what we were talking about before the first step is you releasing them. Yeah. Correct. Because she released him. He didn't even know he needed to be released from her.
[38:53] I mean, certainly... And if you're telling someone that you forgive them without solicitation, are you doing that for your own benefit? Right. To say, hey, look at me and I'm forgiven. Good question. Yeah. Well, it might create different problems that are not necessary.
[39:08] I think you forgive them because God said to forgive them. You don't have to advertise to that person, hey, I forgave them. Yeah. Right. Or not cool. I forgave them. Yeah.
[39:18] Now we have another problem. It could lead to an interesting discussion. Yes. Yeah. Mark? No, I just think that God is the perfect example.
[39:29] He sent Jesus to reconcile us unto himself. So he reached out first and it's up to man to accept it, to receive that, to believe in that.
[39:47] Now, of course, what's God's part even further? He even reaches out further. So, but, so, when you need to be, when you are forgiving somebody, you reach out.
[40:00] But it's like what you said in the beginning. It's up to them. It's a two-way thing. So, our responsibility is to reach out. If they accept it, fantastic. If they don't, then, you can't force them to.
[40:16] Just like God can't force men to accept Jesus. Come on. Come on. Yeah.
[40:27] Yeah. Paul might disagree with it. Yeah. I still think that. I don't think you get into the song. Not you, Paul. I'm talking about the other Paul. But I would say, I think that that goes back to presentation.
[40:40] You're required to forgive that person. I don't think you go up to that person and you're trying to reconcile and say, I forgive you. you just come up to them and say, I apologize.
[40:50] Will you forgive me? And now, it's the onus for them to say, you know, yeah, I forgive you. And whether they pursue it and say, will you forgive me is, you disarned yourself, but you also disarned them.
[41:03] Correct. Instead of saying, I forgive you. you recognize what you did to that person. That forgiveness is independent of the response. You have to reach out.
[41:14] I was going to say, do we have to ask for forgiveness from somebody? If you have an obligation, it's not on good terms. Kind of forgiving them, kind of. And, but like, do you have to reach out to them and say, hey, I apologize for my part in this.
[41:28] Will you forgive me? Exactly. Have you looked at your part in it? Oh, absolutely. Because that's got to be the number one thing, right, is the ending north side of the street. But does it matter if I ask for their forgiveness or, because I'm really, What kind of relationship do you want?
[41:46] I don't foresee there being a relationship. Come over. We're still on definitely different sides of the spectrum. So I just feel like, I'm just wondering. Understood. Understood. I mean, I'm genuinely curious.
[41:58] Understood. Because while we're doing all this talking, someone's name was like, blaring in my head. And I'm like, oh, okay. Oh, Cindy, you've got to go do the Psalm 139 thing. You're not the only one that's up there.
[42:10] Yeah, thank you. I'm glad I'm not alone. Every one of you need to do, no, I'll probably do. That's part of what John commanded. Wait, that's part of what John commanded, that you have to recognize your sin.
[42:23] Yeah. You have to confess it. Yeah. And you have to realize that part of this animosity or whatever it is you hold towards anybody else is you as well as the other. Yeah.
[42:33] Right. And so you pray on it as we've said, as it's been said, you pray on it, you're guiding me. Because even Corrie Ten Boom, she didn't want to put her hand up.
[42:46] She didn't. She didn't want to tell you this week. She debated about that. But as Rick said, the Holy Spirit did pull her hand up.
[42:56] So it ain't beautiful and it ain't perfect and it ain't pretty. But you do want to make sure you're doing what God wants. She did comment that it released her.
[43:09] It did. Absolutely. And that's that's when she felt God's love again. Amen. She felt flooded. Margo. I also very much believe that that love your enemy is not a suggestion.
[43:26] I think it's called Oh, yes. Yes. You've heard that it was said love your neighbor but hate your enemy. which is what the Old Testament said to but I say to you love your enemy and bless those who persecute you.
[43:48] Whole different level. Whole different level. But what is reconciliation? I mean, I'm not giving the knife to the person that's stabbing it.
[44:00] You know, you're you've got somebody that's killed your child. What is reconciliation? Oh. I can get forgiveness and release to yourself.
[44:16] Well, I don't want a relationship with that person. I might say I'm okay if I see you in heaven but I don't want to live next door to them and talk to them over the fence, you know.
[44:31] Isn't reconciliation Not sure Corrie ten Boom wanted to live next to that guy. It implied there was a relationship before. Yes. It's to be reconciled.
[44:43] So, if you didn't have a relationship with that person before, then I don't think reconciliation reconciliation. Yeah. When we're talking reconciliation within yourself.
[44:55] Yeah. Not necessarily with another person. You reconcile that you were going to forgive that person and you're going to move on. That's within yourself.
[45:06] But if we're talking about two people, right, and the way that the New Testament talks about this is within a congregation. It's within a congregation, a body.
[45:17] Well, because it says if you're right and you leave your gift at the altar and be reconciled to be a brother, you would be a brother in Christ.
[45:28] Right. Right. And you're just being an unbeliever. So unbelievers, yeah, we are to, what did we just quote? Quote any of them.
[45:39] They all say. Right. Not hate, love your enemy, pray for your enemy, right? That's the unbeliever. Yeah. You treat them like the Samaritan treated, right? But we're at another level when we're talking about one another.
[45:52] When he talks about in chapter four that you propitiate your brother's sin, right, one another's sin. That's, you already are in a relationship that's supposed to be reciprocal.
[46:05] It's one another. It's not a stranger. It's just somebody I worship with. This is somebody I'm to be loving and not withholding love from. Right, so that's what we're talking about.
[46:18] Basically, how it gets untangled in outer spheres, I don't know. Sometimes it does like the missionary work where you have people initially coming in to establish a missionary.
[46:31] And a close brother gets killed. But years later, that person that did the killing becomes part of the body of Christ.
[46:42] That's right. Right. Yeah, could you imagine the Corinthian church? Right, you know the past those people, Hal, had?
[46:53] Such were some of you. you know, and he lists, whoa. So, you know, how do we deal with our, you know, letting go of that baggage of other people's journeys?
[47:11] Different, Christian to Christian, brother to brother is huge. that's what John isn't talking about loving the world in this book.
[47:24] He does not talk about it. He's not ignoring it. It just simply isn't his subject. How do I know I have eternal life? It's how I relate to God, it's how I relate to my brothers, and how I speak about Christ outwardly.
[47:41] Do I confess or deny? So, yeah, but I appreciate the, those are real questions, but about the other, the Corey Tin Moon kind of situation.
[47:57] I don't think there's a reconciliation issue there. If God wants to bring out a relationship out of that, that's his miraculous work. I don't think she has a responsibility to pursue, oh, can we be friends now?
[48:12] Yeah, I don't. One more thing, Pastor. Oh, you're running out. Okay, I'll take a bit. I was reading a book, and it's actually a biography, it isn't like a fiction book, where there was a woman that had worked in a company.
[48:34] she had worked extremely close with the people involved. She murdered his one daughter. There was the trial, and she was in prison, and such.
[48:50] But the father went to actually the prison, and he had told her, he'd actually forgiven her, but not what she had done to his little daughter.
[49:05] So, did he really forgive her? Well, he'd forgive the sinner, not the sin. True. Right. I can't undo what she did.
[49:21] Yeah, I don't know if that's... Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. No, it is black and white. you either 100% totally forgive them, or you haven't forgiven them.
[49:37] Yeah, I don't know if you can parse forgiveness. Yeah. That's interesting. I don't know. Any other thoughts?
[49:51] Jimmy? One thing that also stuck out to me was in chapter one and in chapter five, how they correlate to each other with confessing, walking in the light and confessing our sins to one another.
[50:07] And then in chapter five, praying for each other's sins, the sins that do not kill. How it kind of starts off that way and then ends that way as well.
[50:23] I thought for sure he was going to make a chiasm, but it never happened. I love the way they do that, right? No, that's part of us. I tried to find a chiasm in first time.
[50:38] I really tried. I tried to look and see what that would look like. You know, if we just all came together and just went down the row and I think you would have to have so much trust that God would be in control of that.
[50:58] To confess our sins? To confess all your sins. You know, everything that I mean, I'm sure that we sin and don't even know it a lot of times, but there's probably sins that we do, do, do, do, that probably need confession.
[51:21] Yeah, well chapter one talks about, right, if we walk, if we together walk in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus cleanses us from sin.
[51:38] So that walking in the light together implies warts and all, I'm in the light, we're all in the light, we don't hide our sin.
[51:51] Right? And that's what real fellowship means. Now, on what level do you do that? I wouldn't suggest doing that on this level, but in a small group, yeah.
[52:07] That's what we want to do in our men's group. Right? You do that on a level that you're all, you know you're all, you're all believers.
[52:21] Right? And when I restarted the men's group, I was in depression and I did it partly because I knew there was power in the small group, right, and to confess that to the men.
[52:40] So I did it selfishly, but I did it for that reason, because I believed in the power of the group, that God worked through that small group, that he would cleanse, there would be a true fellowship, and I knew I needed that, because if I would hide that, nothing a depressed person wants to do more, right, than crawl in a hole.
[53:03] I want to get out and, right, so, since I started the group, I had to be there. I tell you it hit so much to me. But that was the verse that I was clinging to, and I wanted to see the reality of that.
[53:21] Now, that was also a scary, risky thing, because there had been men in the previous group who had betrayed me, and hurt me.
[53:32] And so, if I do this again, is that going to happen again? It could. I can get burned again. But, what am I going to do?
[53:44] Am I going to hide in fear, or am I going to do what God says? there's always a risk. And it's scary to walk in the light with one another, to really share.
[53:59] I think it's the power of AA groups, isn't it? It breaks part of that issue. It breaks, right? So, and that's tapped into Christian scripture.
[54:13] That's where they get that. Not they, but whoever started the whole thing, right? So, if we're having trouble breaking some sin, we can't do it on our own.
[54:32] So, that's the chapter five. You see a brother. You see a brother sinning, not to eternal death, just regular sinning. He's caught.
[54:42] He's stuck. Pray for him. He needs help. He needs help. And that's one of the prayers God will, I'm going to fulfill that prayer. Pray that prayer. I'm going to give him life.
[54:53] You pray for that brother. Because I want you, I'm going to use you to get that brother back on track. God. So, whether he's confessed it to you or you just observe it because you're close enough to that brother to know something's off here.
[55:13] And then you observe, oh, I know what's off. I've just seen, right? So, you're observing. It's not, but yeah, if he's confessing it to you, I mean, that's what I hope happens in our small group.
[55:24] hey, I'm struggling with this. Will you pray for me? I got bitterness. I got lust. I got anger. I got whatever it is.
[55:36] I can't get out of that. Right now, I'm stuck in it. So, will you pray for me? Anybody here struggled with that? Then you can talk to me too. Maybe you, you know, we can get a anger anonymous group or something.
[55:54] Whatever helps. Anything else? When I was growing up, my mom used to describe me and my dad. I was the oldest of four boys.
[56:05] Mom says she had five boys counting dad. But mom described dad and I especially as being like two rams with a corn socket and neither one of them would give up.
[56:17] You know, they'd keep pulling and tugging and this whole bit. And there was one day, the church I worked at in Omaha and flexibility to go out to lunch with my dad every week to ten days.
[56:28] He always bought, come and pick me up. And there was one day in particular, it was the early 90s, it was in May, and I just felt like I was really convicted to ask my dad some questions about growing up.
[56:40] And the way that I was treated and some things. He was an only child and didn't know how to reach out to people. And I just felt strongly convicted the whole time we were eating and it's like I kept getting nudged like I'm supposed to talk and we're sitting in Arby's and there's all kinds of people around us and we go back and he pulls up to the curb to the main entrance and my dad starts to talk.
[57:06] And apparently what God was nudging me for was to be prepared not necessarily to say anything. But all of a sudden my dad starts talking to me side by side and he just says you know I just know that I could have done a much better job raising the whole voice than I did.
[57:27] And he starts naming specific things. There was like five or six things he just said and he just asked me to forgive him. And I listened very intently to everything that man said to me.
[57:43] And I repeated back to him everything that he said and I said you just mentioned this and I said dad I want you to know I feed you and went on and all five or six things and there was such a rush such a flush that came through and Chrysler never could expand on this in a commercial for something that happens in their minivans but there was such a moment between me and my dad I had always grown up respecting my dad I never called him old man that was a disrespect thing to me never cussed him out we were physical like hitting each other type of thing he was just emotionally hard on me but all of that was released and all of a sudden our relationship turned around and it's what I just said a little bit about being released from that frustration of dad what about this what about this what about this it released us and for the rest of our lives together he passed away in
[58:47] September of 2011 we were free to just joke with each other and enjoy life and have fun and just want minors back and forth but the freedom that came listening to my dad say I need to ask for your forgiveness it released me and he had to have been released before that moment even started a little prompting going on there tip another coffee cut thank you thank you powerful stuff okay shall we close thank you father for your goodness thank you for this incredible book that I know has affected me deeply profoundly and I thank you lord for the challenge that has brought to all of us particularly what's how are we authentic in our faith and particularly how do we love one another that's huge so father help us to get more and more like you because of what you've done to us this we pray in christ's name amen amen if you're able please stand blessed be your name in the land that is plentiful where your streams of abundance flow blessed be your name blessed be your name when I'm found in the desert place though I walk through the wilderness
[61:30] NING